Tuesday, May 18, 2010

New Mosque in the Town of Wilson

I attended the meeting of the Town of Wilson Board on Monday. I spoke at that meeting as well, even though I knew what would happen. I knew, going in that this was simply going to be a vote on whether or not the building that is to be used as a mosque was up to code according to town ordinances. The board graciously allowed everyone to speak, who had signed in to do so, even though the majority, myself included, were not town residents.

Of the 6 residents who spoke, 4 were in favor and 2 were opposed. Of the 19 non-residents who signed in to speak, approximately 12 were opposed and 5 were in favor. (I say approximately because I honestly could not decipher what two of the speakers were saying. Sometimes this was because of their presentation, or a poor quality microphone(or perhaps timidity at speaking to a group) and sometimes it was due to accents. We have an increasingly diverse population and sometimes a heavy accent make it a bit difficult to understand a speaker.

The problem is that none of the speakers were addressing Town of Wilson ordinances. (Except one older gentleman whom the board corrected as his understanding of the ordinances was in error.) My own 3 minutes, was attempting to address the sovereignty issue that I have written about on this blog before. I believe that, by allowing this mosque to come into existence without giving a proper respect to the governing aspect of the religion of Islam, the board is, in effect, ceding United States sovereignty over that piece of property in perpetuity. This may seem like an absurd position to some, but I hope to explain it in another post. (I also intend to address it in my blogtalkradio show: Irate, Tireless Minority. It's 30 minutes on Wednesdays at 1:30pm.

As is so often the case, when a community becomes concerned enough about an issue to speak up and make a difference, it is too late to participate in the political processes concerning that issue. People go to a town board meeting, which is disconcerting for the board members because the meetings are usually deserted, get up and speak to an issue in a way that can have no affect on the outcome of that issue, because the board must deal with only the limited bit of the issue that they have any say over, in this case, building ordinances. The board is not allowed to take most of the speakers views into consideration, and this board commented to that effect, saying the use of this building as a mosque was approved months ago, you should have spoken then. Unfortunately, the word didn't go out into the community until long after that decision was approved.

So, having brought along his lawyers to assure the board that the building either was, or soon would be, in compliance with all Town of Wilson ordinances concerning a public building, the good doctor (who will, as a matter of course, be donating the land this mosque occupies to Allah in perpetuity to be used as a mosque,) was to have his permit granted. The board voted unanimously to approve the conditional use permit. The people who came to speak, one way or another all went home dissatisfied with the government process and feeling like they had been made fools of(even those who spoke in favor, because it was clear that their speeches were not to the issue at hand either) and that their government officials are corrupt or hold the people in disdain or are simply ignoring them.

I don't think they are/do. I think they are doing a job by the rules laid out for them, but that those rules are so alien to most people that the ordinary citizen becomes disenfranchised by their use. Surely there must be a better way to get some citizen input on issues like this which become volatile after it is too late to address the core issue. I don't know what that would be. Perhaps the media needs to get better at doing their jobs and actually inform people before it's too late for the community to have an informed debate on controversial issues. The media was present in droves. I counted 8 cameras. Most of them stayed only long enough to get the sound bites they needed for their story and then left before the vote. Why would they stay? They know what is going to happen, they've been to enough of these types of meetings before.

There must be a better way to bring controversial issues like this before the people without making everyone involved look like fools. What could have been a respectful dialogue resulting in a productive solution, now ends with resentment and bitterness all around. The doctor who purchased the land to be used as a mosque was upset. He said "why is it that when you want me to be your doctor, I am a good guy, but when I want to put up a mosque, I am a terrorist?" Those who support the mosque will feel out of sorts with their neighbors who do not. Those who opposed the mosque will feel that their government has turned against them by allowing such a threat into the community. Those who attend the mosque will feel threatened, leading, no doubt to the very behaviors that concern those who opposed the mosque. The United States loses theological (Theological de jure and possibly real sovereignty de facto)sovereignty over yet another parcel of real estate to Allah in perpetuity and everybody goes home unhappy. It's a sad day in America, when the community cannot come together and put off or re-visit the vote on such a divisive issue until an understanding is reached that allows everyone to be able to live with the results of such a vote.

For those who would tell me that a mosque is not a threat to any community, I will say that you need to study more. I will not say that there aren't things which could be agreed to by the Islamic community to mitigate that threat in a way that would satisfy most communities, as I believe that there are. I will not say that Islam is not a threat to it's neighbors, by it's very nature, because there are simply too many examples world wide that it is. I will not condemn individuals, but there is enough evidence to make the claim that "Islam is a religion of peace" ridiculous on it's face. Unless, of course, you are using the Islamic definition of "peace" which is "submission to Allah". For those who assured the group, particularly the members of Christian clergy, that "we are all worshipping the same God". No. We are not, and if you think we are, then I suggest that you have not done your homework.

This could have been handled differently and it should have been. I think there is a way to move forward that would both meet the community's need to feel safe and the Muslim community's wish for a place of worship. Although, I must concede that I doubt the Muslim community would even consider my suggestion, since they don't have to and the United States is pleased to continue in it's ignorance regarding the dictates of the theological government of the "citizens of Islam".

" Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly.
Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

I and my Father are one.
"~John 10:24-30


Dr.D said...

"He said "why is it that when you want me to be your doctor, I am a good guy, but when I want to put up a mosque, I am a terrorist?""

It is probably very difficult, but in so far as possible, this doctor should be boycotted. His practice should suffer from a lack of patients, we hope enough that he will be forced to leave the community. Perhaps without his support, the mosque will fold.

(Also, why on earth do you call him the "good" doctor? What is good about any muzlim?)

In general, the only real weapon we have against muzlims in our communities is to boycott them, to force them to leave because they cannot make a living with us. This sounds unfriendly, but we have to remember, they are not among us to be friends, but rather to conquer us.

Call Me Mom said...

Dr. D,
I called him the good doctor, because I assume that he is a skilled doctor to be able to afford to purchase a property that he will donate to Allah to be used as a mosque.

As for boycotting the doctor or the other Muslim of the community, I fail to see how that will dissolve the waqf that was created for the mosque. To the best of my knowledge, the waqfs for mosques are created in perpetuity, thus creating a condition whereby US sovereignty over this piece of ground has been ceded to Allah in perpetuity, in the minds of the followers of Islam worldwide.

If I can abandon a principle for my own safety, then it is not a principle it's a prop. The principle of religious freedom is one I hold dear. I cannot abandon it because the next fellow chooses to worship a false god.
I know many folks are in favor of abandoning principle for safety in this matter, as it seems, right now, to be a losing battle, but I am not. This is a matter of faith as well as principle.

On another note how does driving these folks out of our communities witness to them about the love of Christ for them? His blood was shed for them too. I am firmly of the opinion that conversion is ultimately going to be the more effective measure to combat the incremental advance of Islam in this country and others than any legislative measure we could attempt. And I am surprised that you, as a member of the Christian clergy do not think so. Have faith sir. The word of God does not return void. Our best weapon is not economic, but spiritual.

In the meantime, we need to work on finding a way for US law to address the formation of these waqfs with regard to maintaining US sovereignty over our soil in the hearts and minds of the worldwide, intangible country of Islam.

Dr.D said...

Mom, in the real world, people make deeds "in perpetuity" from time to time, but in actual fact they only last until conditions change. By that I mean until the money provided for their maintenance runs out, or until there is a new government that does not recognize the actions of the previous government. Then those actions that were "to last forever," are voided. Witness the pyramids and countless other ancient monuments.

The only thing that gives teeth to these miserable actions of muzlims is the cowardly fear of our government to enforce our laws and customs in our own country. They do it because of well known muzlim violence.

I think we have very good reason for wanting to keep the number of muzlims in our community to very small numbers. If they become significant numbers, they begin to put all manner of unreasonable demands on our society, enforcing sharia law on us when they reach even 5% of the population or there abouts. Anytime we permit a mosque to be built, we see the number of muzlims in a community begin to grow rapidly; it is like a metastasizing cancer. For this reason, it is extremely important to prevent the establishment of mosques.

You take me to task for not wanting to convert the muzlims. That is not true, but I ask you to consider the parable of the sower as recorded in both Mark and Luke. The seed falls in several different places with different results in each case. To the extent that the sower is able to direct his seed, where would you recommend that he direct it?

There is no doubt that Christ died for the muzlims just as much as for you and for me. But they come to us case hardened against the Word, and not just a little bit. We have some opportunities to get through to them provided that we can keep their numbers small, but when their numbers get large, they reinforce each other against us. For this reason, it is imperative to keep their numbers small. We must operate as a Western nation and never give in to them.

We cannot do this when we kowtow as in allowing the construction of a mosque.

Call Me Mom said...

That is the problem. With those in Islam who record such perpetual trusts, to allow them to continue unfettered is to allow the nation to be sold to the intangible country of Islam.

If we respect the their freedom of religion and require, through legislation, that such trusts in the USA cannot be made to be perpetual trusts, we are defusing a long term bomb. By attaching ceertain conditions to such such trusts, we can give those muslims who purport to be non-violent a reason to act in the interests of the community when those who will incite violence come into the community.

I think most Germans will tell you that the majority of Germany were not Nazis, but they were still cowed by the Nazis when they came into power. The title of my own blog, is illustrative of the effect a small number of people may have.

I did take you to task and I will do so again. God is capable of bringing any number of world hardened individuals to Him, if it serves His purpose. Our job is to witness.

Our shame as a nation/people is that we have allowed our faith and our doctrines to become so watered down, that very few Christians even know what they believe and why, much less are they able to be effective apologists for their own faith.

Ordinary Jill said...

If you're not careful, Wilson will start to look like Dearborn, MI, where the large Moslem population has imposed Sharia law -- oh, wait; no they didn't. But things are different there -- the Walmart stocks headscarves and halal (similar to kosher) foods, as well as the usual stuff you find at a Walmart.

As a resident of Madison and a graduate of the UW, I am accustomed to seeing Malaysian women in head scarves. I believe there is also at least one mosque in town, but I've never noticed it and couldn't tell you where it is. Nor have I noticed any changes in life here over the past 30 years with regards to the Moslems in our midst.

The countries where Moslems try to impose Sharia law have a host of other political and economic problems. In places where Moslems are given opportunities, the overwhelming majority become reasonably assimilated. There are always a few wing-nuts, but the same can be aid of Christians (David Koresh comes to mind).

Of course, you can continue to cocoon yourself in ignorance and intolerance if you choose, but those choices will have consequences. If you behave as a bad neighbor, you will eventually have neighborhood feuds.

DR said...

I was shocked when I read in the paper that a mosque was going in south of Sheboygan. Since a lot of these things are financed from Saudi Arabia, I think your point was right on. Thank you for standing up for all of us.

Call Me Mom said...

It is my understanding, from coverage in the Sheboygan Press, that this mosque received support from a CAIR subsidiary as well.

Ordinary Jill,
First of all, welcome to the blog. Secondly, I grew up in Madison and still have family there, so I can tell you that there is more than one mosque in Madison and, yes the city is different than it was thirty years (or more) ago.

Secondly, let me repeat what I said to Dr. D.: "I think most Germans will tell you that the majority of Germany were not Nazis, but they were still cowed by the Nazis when they came into power. The title of my own blog, is illustrative of the effect a small number of people may have." By many estimates, 80% of the mosques in America have been funded or supported in some way through the Saudis. The Saudis advocate a fundamental form of Islam and they are working to spread that form of Islam(Wahabism). The goal of all Islam is to propagate and expand Islam until it dominates the entire world. As Sharia law is one of the tenets of the Muslim religious/governmental system, there is no reason for me to believe that Muslims who are currently "reasonably assimilated" into the culture of the US will continue to be "moderate" when they have numbers enough to elect their own and vote sharia law into existence. There are at least 30 Islamic countries around the world today. Many of them have sharia law in place. It's not a nice legal system, especially for women. I strongly advise you to read blogs/websites which are doing their best to keep us informed like Gates of Vienna, ACT for America and jihad watch. The creeping incrementalism of this intangible governmental form poses a serious threat to this nation and others.

Thirdly, I will tell you that you have obviously not done your homework regarding Islam in general or Dearborn in particular. See here and here and here for just a few of the changes besides the local Wal-Mart selling halal food and headscarves.

I would also suggest that you review the doctrine of Mr. Koresh and any other "Christian" cult leader you would like to drag into the conversation to prove that Islam is no more dangerous than Christianity. I haven't heard that any of them advocated killing non-believers. The same cannot be said for the mainstream followers of Islam. In fact, in countries that employ sharia law, it is a capital offense to convert away from Islam. If you ask a Muslim about this, they will tell you that there is no compulsion in religion. Technically, they are correct. But since Islam also contains a governmental system, those who convert away from Islam are tried and convicted for treason under the dictates of sharia law.

You are quite correct that bad neighbors will create strife, but I would ask you to tell me who is the bad neighbor in your opinion? The one whose friends and relatives encourage them to force out or kill all the current residents of the neighborhood so that more family can move in, or the one who welcomes anyone willing to live peaceably in the same area? No matter how "peaceful" the current Muslims may claim/appear to be, they present a threat to the community by providing an avenue to those in their "family" who advocate violence towards the community.

As for my "cocooning myself in ignorance and intolerance", I have spent a bit of time over the past ten years studying Islam, so I don't think that ignorant applies. Intolerant, on the other hand, perhaps I am. I find it difficult to tolerate the notion that my new neighbors may believe I should be killed simply because I am not Muslim.